Mind Candies for a Lousy Day (A Short and Snappy Guide Book 3)
People involved in the budget tourism industry know what backpackers are looking for— including some shady operators who have honed their con artist skills. There are very targeted scams, like having a dozen illegitimate businesses with the same name and logo as the main bus company set up all over town. It can be frustrating as a foreigner, but if you travel with your guard up and take simple precautions e.
To be honest, I found southern Thailand even worse with respect to the negative aspects than Vietnam. Yep — I had a great time also. Would go back in a heartbeat.
Why I’ll Never Return to Vietnam
And might have a horrible time next time. I had a pretty horrible time in Ethiopia and Russia, but I know plenty of people that have loved those places. I simply had a bad time. I am sorry that you feel that wat about Vietnam Matt. But that is no different to any other country in SEA.
In Thailand you will get charged 3 times the price for a T-shirt then a local would , and in India the chai is double the price for westerners. It sounds like you had a combination of bad experiences. Sorry to hear about your misfortune. I will definitely return to Vietnam. Interesting to hear your take Matt. It seems, as with anything, that money is the great divider. I even spoke with people who had worse experiences, such as a guy who was mugged in Nha Trang by a woman who was on the back of a scooter which rode up to him, she jumped off, grabbed his … attention … pulled all his cash out of his pockets then jumped back on the bike and took off.
Obviously, this poor fellow was in a bit of a bind as to whether to fight back especially against a woman , and so all he could do was let it happen. I think that the fact that travel in Vietnam is basically a geographic funnel adds to this situation, though. That is to say, in the towns along the tourist trail, vendors will overcharge and mistreat customers because, even if they upset them, they will be moving on in a day or two, and another sucker will be along shortly. The only town I kind of enjoyed was Da Lat, and that was probably because tourism there seemed to be somewhat subdued compared to anywhere else along the trail possible because most people chose to travel through Mui Ne instead.
I would prefer to spend my time, and money, in a country where you are not taken for granted, or milked for all you are worth. My time in Burma, for instance, was some of the most relaxing, and connected, time I ever spent, even though the people there have alot more to complain about than the people of modern-day Vietnam. Yikes what terrible experiences!!! Went through Vietnam with my 2 kids last summer. Thought it was amazing. A bit like what Thailand was like about 15 or 20 years ago — less developed tourist infrastructure but still not bare bones.
See it before it gets really popular. Sorry to hear about your bad experiences. Vietnam is one of the countries I really want to visit. This puts me off, but I guess the temptation of at least one visit will remain. Thanks for sharing something beyond just the good stuff. Like I say I was tad surprised as it is obvious from your post that you are a long term traveller.
In general the sooner that people leave those backpacker places behind, the sooner they escape being ripped off. Ohh I have no problem overpaying. They were mean about it. They need the money more than me. Then again sometimes you have no choice. One of my favourite memories of my first backpacking trip, back in 97, was drinking a local cocktail called Vietnam Star. It was about 25c a glass, we went through a few bottles of spirits. We went the next day and they had doubled the price. They either lost money on the deal, or wanted to make more money. I have a strong feeling it was the former.
An American in Vietnam complaining about being treated rudely? Should the Germans owe me because their grandfathers put Jews in camps? They apologize and move on. Do young Australians have to bear the cross for what was done to the Aboriginals in the early 20th century when they had no control?
NomadicMatt is so right! I understand that people hold grudges for a long time and I know this is hard if you were treated badly.
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I have Irish family and when i go to Ireland and my english accent is heard people get funny because of the history betwen England and Ireland centuries ago! But when they here I am of Irish descent they say that is fine but it gets my back up. Its wrong and people shouldnt blame a single person for wrongdoings by a country in its past. I am planning on going to Asia and Vietnam! Hopefully I wont have a problem being English does help with Vietnamese people. I want to respond for a few reasons — 1. My other concern is that you arent willing to consider the likely impact of being an American in a country in still a very sore place following a horrific act of war from the US..
You mentioned that its not your fault and you didnt do it, just in the way todays Germans didnt murder Jewish people, or Australians myself didnt murder Aboriginal people. I would argue that as an Australian person I have the responsibility to educate myself, understand and pay respects for the ills of my ancestors against Aboriginal people and Vietnamese people for their participation in what was basically attempted genocide. To say you have no ties to your cultural hegemony as a white American or your ancestors crimes in hideous wars is a very ignorant disposition to carry around and to me it somewhat explains why the beautiful Vietnamese culture was lost on you.
Your writing raises lots of debates among us, the Vietnamese. Sorry for all such bad experiences you had here. We surely have to do a lot to improve the tourism industry and we are doing that. Like many other travelers commented, they also encountered your experiences and they found lots of beautiful things about places and people, too. I am the young generation born after the America-VN war ended. We are not taught that Westerner owes Vietnamese but to put aside the past and look forward to future cooperation. There is no hard feeling to the Westerners from Vietnamese, even from the veterans who were prisoned and mostly-dead tortured by American agents or method.
We are living for present and future, not for the past.
Mind Candies for a Lousy Day - A Short and Snappy Guide
We look forward to the day you return to Vietnam and have great experience. I am in Hochiminh City, you have my email add. You feeled annoying about the women who made the drink for you because you thought that she laughed at your face. You might be misunderstood them. I know that kind of plastic water bag.
They feeled pleasant about that, that why they laughed. They are happy with a little bit strange when you use that kind of product from them. Some times you see this behaviour when you buy Street Food. It is not because they are successed in cheating you. All American people are warmly welcome in Vietnam. Ask other American about that. Interesting article and really helpful comments. Interesting to read about off-the-beaten track and on-the-beaten-track in terms of ripped off-edness. Thom loves the beaten track because the LP writes about it extensively whereas I prefer a little off the track for that very reason.
Vietnam will be the last country in my list going my the treatment i underwent while in Hanoi. My company tour this year is to HCMC sigh. Hope history does not repeats. I had exactly the same experience as you in Vietnam Matt. I had a few worse things happen than what you mention in Cambodia but still loved the place. Previously recently for a free promotional tour thing in NY you wrote that to understand a place and the people you need to look at their history. How experienced were you when you travelled to Vietnam? As I travelled more I showed less sympathy for people trying to rip me off and worked my way around it a lot better.
I feel a veteran traveller would have less issues their than someone in their first months in asia. Interesting way to look at it. I had been on the road 9 months by the time I got into Vietnam. This was back in We met some wonderful people, loved the hustle and bustle of the cities and of course the food was incredible. The point is though, we all need to take a step back some times and ask ourselves how representative our experience is?
So much can depend on your mind-set at the time and matters of absolute chance such as crime, getting ripped off and getting ill. If nothing else it does have a considerably lower banana pancake quotient than the rest of SE Asia. Very interesting points here. I was in Vietnam a few years back but as part of an organised tour with STA Travel so we had all our accommodation prebooked and transport organised.
We also had a Vietnamease tour guide with us so they were able to help us out should we need. I also agree with some of the others, perhaps you were on a well carved backpacker route where touts are known to aggressively target travelers. I traveled to Vietnam in when tourism was relatively new there. The landscape and the people impressed me for a couple of reasons. As for the people, I agree they are aggressive, a bit sour, but I took it as some hard-line entrepreneurship. They have an energy to forge ahead, not feel sorry for themselves, and get on with it. Personally, I admired that.
North Americans can be whiny, myself included. As for getting ripped off, that never happened to me. I had an argument with a hotel desk girl about handing over my passport, but later on I made her smile. The way you were treated could be because you are American. You never mentioned the countries of origin of your friends…? I plan to go back this trip and venture more North. The Vietnam War museums are great! Such great communist propaganda about how brothers and sisters beat back the imperial dogs of the french and the americans!
I have lived in Vietnam for 4 years. Statistically there is a. My wife is from the Mekong Delta and we lived in Vung Tau for the last 6 months. Because Vung Tau is populated by mostly northerners, none of our neighbors would speak or even look at us. Whenever my wife went to the market I could not go, the prices increased dramatically.
When we traveled to Hanoi because my wife had a southern accent and the words were different she was ridiculed and made to say things over again while the street vendors would snicker.
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The level of prejudice in some parts of the country is saddening. We are now back in Saigon HCMC now and I have been subjected to every scam so I am no longer a target but the tales of woe are abundant and I have seen people loose everything they owned. I love my extended family who are the most accepting and supportive people and I love the country. I stay there for those things, I have seen Vietnam change in the 10 years of my travels throughout Asia and it is as cutthroat there as Manila, Bangkok or Pnomh Penh and until the worldwide recession is over I would stay away.
I met your travel partner Shannon this weekend. She had the opposite to say. A perfect example of two people, same place, two different experiences. I just found the vietnamese a bit open and rude about it. How could you believe the guy who translated, while he was American too? I never used a guidebook in Vietnam and I got off the tourist trail quite a bit.
I took local transportation many times, ended up on small towns in the north, and biked around the Mekong Delta with friends of mine. I have and always been a traveler who enjoys getting off the beaten path. So sad to hear you had such a bad experience in Vietnam! Breath of fresh air. Vietnam was on my first tour of Vietnam and we hit a few situations where people were superb. In Dalat the bikers took us to the hospital as my girlfriend started to feel really sick 40 minutes into it and they really helped us there.
When she felt sick in Mui Ne one of the local restaurant owners made up some special drinks for her for me to take back to the room although we had built up a good bond there. In Nah Trang we had a great night with locals in one of the late night bars. We travelled as a couple backpacking and took the normal bus route from South to North which I never looked forward to, but despite being droppped off with no accommodation we found some superb stuff just from the touts on the bus and I really thought it would be the other way round.
In Hoi An we had a superb little restaurant we frequented and got treated so well it was hard to believe and the food was superb, and very cheap. As some of the comments and responses have indicated you get good an bad experiences in many countries depending who you travel with, how you react to things, and just the circumstances you end up in.
If you do go, this is one place I found it was really good to splurge on accommodation if you wanted a break from backpacking…. As for the post itself, good that you speak your mind, but I hope others only treat it as one experience, which may be wildly different from the experience they have. My comments are from a trip inlate I think age, race, and appearance can definitely factor into how we are treated abroad. And you make a good point that they may not have fond feelings for the West. While I really enjoyed the architecture and history of Istanbul, I hated just being there.
Mind Candies for a Lousy Day: A Short and Snappy Guide by Thejendra Sreenivas on Apple Books
It was all in attempts to get me into their establishment. Yelling at me that their restaurant was better than the one down the street, and pulling me into the cafe so I could look at the menu. When we were lost, a nice older man came by and offered to help us find our way. Some of the people in the markets definitely tried ripping me off, and some of the men were straight-up harassing us—one guy working at a restaurant got very physically affectionate with me and it was not OK.
Some of them were harmless and friendly, probably just really hurting for money. But after a few days there I was dying to just walk down a street and not feel bombarded by people trying to get my money. Sorry this was so long…. Clearly it appears to be a glass case of emotions with all the responses, but Ill be sure to watch out for women who try pull sell me water bags without the lemon and sugar, international heads will roll. You have a bad experience and it clouds your perception of a place. A friend of mine complained about her time in Paris because everyone was rude.
And we all have our loves and hates in travel, but you seem to be painting Vietnam with a pretty broad brush. But if you went back, would you be able to go without any negative perceptions? Not sure if I ever will travel to Vietnam, though I would love to, but I imagine I would go gladly willing to spend all the money I could to a nation so ravaged in the past.
I imagine I would like feeling as if I am balancing out the world a bit. Then again, you may be just exactly right. If they treat me like dirt and try to rip me off, why should they be entitled to anything at ALL?
The Vietnamese have every right to hate Americans. Who are you in your comfortable world to tell them how to behave now. It is for sure Vietnamese, from youngsters to old veterans; do not have hard feeling to Westerners. The war ended 37 years ago. My father was Northern soldier and got wounded in the war. He sometimes also told us his post-war thought; there is no hateness to American. I lived there 2 months, even fractured my forehead in a random bike accident. Everyone there was nothing but super nice. Most backpackers get used to Thailand and assume everyone is going to want to be there friend.
I hope you give the country another shot with an open mind. Oh man, you described my experience to a T. Seriously, I have no idea why the people were so rude there. They constantly tried to rip me off, laughed at me while doing it and some bastard even tried jumping my cab meter. Not to mention, the constant beeping and honking of a million motobikes drove me nearly insane.
Needless to say, when I landed in Laos, it was like I was reborn. They say Vietnam is a country that you either hate or love. Like you, I definitely leaned towards the former. We went to a restaurant and my two friends got a menu in English. My menu was in Vietnamese and the prices were markedly lower. We ordered our drinks from the Vietnamese menu and made sure the waiter knew about it. When we had finished our drinks, the tab came and of course it was with the English menu prices.
We called the manager and a 15 minute argument ensued. In the end, we refused to pay the inflated prices, gave him the money and left the place pissed off. Ruined what would have otherwise been a great afternoon. My first time in Vietnam was for a total of two months backpacking as part of greater Asia-Africa trip, traveling south to north, in ; amazing.
No issues apart from constant demands from street beggars like India. Now, in , I revisited on an overland trip from Bangkok into central China, via Laos and the Bien Dien Phu route, and I still loved traveling Vietnam even thou I knew there were a few inflated prices …but no rudeness, quite the opposite. But I have had negative experiences in Russia — drugged, robbed; Iraq — arrested as a spy; mugged in Brazil; YET these things never soured my outlook or experience of these countries. I love everywhere …. I totally disagree on the fact that Westerners, and Americans in particular, owe something to Vietnam.
I tend to think that people enhance or ruin my experience while travelling around a country. I guess that at some point I just learnt to ignore them which is a shame I know but I felt that I had no option. I might agree with you or not but I totally understand that what you write is based on subjective info.
My wife and I spent 3 weeks in northern and sother vietnam and had a great time. Loved the vibrant 24 hour street culture, bia hoi beers on the street, and amazing kayaking ih hailong bay. I first went to Saigon in — just after it opened — before there was free travel within the country which is why I never got permits to leave HCM and when there was no Lonely Planet!
In I went back. We stayed in local hotels — often with locals, caught local buses generally — we got the normal bargaining of course — but nothing worse than anywhere else in SEA. We did once get a backpackers bus from HCM to Mui Nee — we had booked a hotel which we knew was in to the south of the town. To my amazement out of 40 odd backpackers on the bus only us and one other couple got off. The tout tried to tell us there were no taxis in town — I just laughed at him it was the middle of the day — I could see traffic.
I thought we would start a charge off the bus — but all the others just sat there waiting to be taken to a no doubt over-priced hotel! The so-called independent travellers were more passive than your average bus tour! There does seem to be quite a disparity- I met people who loved it and people who hated it.
I was not such a big fan of Vietnam. It was too touristed on the main routes and met more than my share of rude people along the way. I had a local rip up money and throw it at me on the train which was probably the most insulting. I also had a lady in a grocery store give me candy instead of change. I absolutely loved Sapa and the smaller towns like Dalat. I found for the most part that the people working in hotels were really friendly and gave great service. I do sympathise with everything you said, and could see how it would all get a person down.
But despite it all, Vietnam is my favourite place in the world, and I go back again and again. A word on the candy instead of change: But it drives Vietnamese people crazy too. Sellers are pushy, walking around is not a pleasant experience with the trafic and constant motobike offers.
Shopping is IMO very boring, the few malls are dull, the markets I went to were disgusting. IMO Thailand and Malaysia have much more to offer, with less hassle. My number one personal complain about Vietnam is really how dull it is. I have just returned from one and a half months in Vietnam and had the same experience as Matt but worse, despite meeting, mixing and dining with some of the local people.
When I was with a Vietnamese I was treated as a curiosity and never ripped off. However when I was on my own it was a nightmare, I was stalked, stolen from, laughed at by rude police, and hotel staff. I felt terribly unsafe. The experience has nothing to do with whether you are nice or not. Vietnamese generally, are rude and aggressive, even the expats who love the place admit this dire quality of the people. And they do not believe in any kind of decent service in return to be paid.
And those from the US, I met many Vietnamese from the South who had fond memories of Americans soldiers who often fed them and took the children on boat rides and attempted to protect them from the Communists, they were grateful. It is a complex country with a complex history. I attempted to understand the culture, but the people made my journey unenjoyable. I met 45 travelers including myself who were stolen from and mugged. Crime is increasing there and I would appreciate knowing where people can complain, travelers seem to simply walk away after being treated so badly but I think travelers need to demand more in this case.
My journey was the trip from hell and it was the people who made it so. Of course it happens elsewhere but not to the extent I witnessed in Vietnam. The Balinese were advised to improve their attitude and they did. I feel the same way about Bolivia as you do Vietnam. I also had a string of bad circumstances happen in Bolivia that left a bad taste in my mouth. Everyone has their country they hate… right now mine is Bolivia, yours is Vietnam. To each their own.
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I spent three weeks backpacking in Vietnam this summer and had an amazing time. Although I was scammed a couple of times and experienced occasional hostility, most people were incredibly welcoming and hospitable. And in my opinion the sites, culture and beauty of Vietnam made up for any rare unkindness. To be honest I found some of the other tourists to be more unpleasant.
I guess sometimes you get lucky. We can totally relate! Vietnam was the most frustrating place we visited during our trip around the world. Fortunately I guess we met a fun group of travelers to spend our month in Vietnam with which made it fun and easier to watch out for one another. An odd discrepancy I noticed was that the people who have no stake in you are friendly and eager to help you out this happened all the time when my motorbike broke down in the countryside whereas the people who deal regularly with tourists tour operators, guesthouse owners, vendors etc.
Incidentally, I wrote about all this on my blog, which was eventually discovered by an expat in Hanoi who blew his top off and rounded up all his Twitter buddies for an online attack. Expats are so touchy. Anyway, their neighbours the Cambodians are much friendlier and frankly Cambodia is more interesting anyway. Never made it to laos, but I hear good things.
I went to Nam back in 04 for the first time since I was 2 yrs old back in As we shopped in Saigon, the vendors did their best to grab my attention and pull me away from my family. The street beggars stalked me constantly and accosted me when I was alone. At Vung Tau Beach, street vendors ruined our picnic by pleading with me to buy their stuff the entire time we were there.
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Despite these incidents, I had a great time because my mom haggled for me when I wanted to buy something. She made sure I got the correct change although I tipped big everytime. She showed me where to go and where not to go to ensure I had a great time all the time. Hope you have a better experience next time….. Ive been to Vietnam and loved it…what did you expect?
There are prices for locals and prices for tourists.. Otherwise none of us would bother travelling…. I expect and have no problem paying the tourist price. What bothered me was the attitude and overall unpleasant experience. I went to China directly after Vietnam and found the average Chinese person to be way, way friendlier than the average Vietnamese person. They might be laughing about your big nose, height, bald spot, etc. Generally speaking, Southerners are more friendlier than Northerners.
The south has more animosity towards the north because of what happened after the unification and how people were treated, not because of American abandonment. Get over your selves. Business people are generally rude and the locals know this. There are currently a lot of scams that are NOT run by Vnamese but by people from other countries, on tourists.
Most of these criminals are from the Philipines, China, Nigeria, etc,. The Vietnamese scams are more low level street peddler stuff and rigged taxi meters. Here, you have to be a complete idiot to not get on friendly terms with your neighbors. And I will go out of my way and say that this is generally what happens all over the world. Give it another chance.
How many tourists actually meet real Vietnamese citizens — damn few. Most travelers are only in contact with hotel and travel people when they tour the country. I have made several very good friends in the north of the country mostly Hanoi , and I go back to see these friends and to make new friends there. Vietnam is the real thing, but too many travelers want Disneyland! Yes, everyone should speak English for your convenience Einstein.
Then to hear people bitch and moan about trivial things like getting your 2 cents returned in candies is utterly asinine. So for this author to believe what a backpacker has to say about how Vietnamese people teach their children is borderline insane. I was just going on what an expat who had lived their for 10 years told me. In fact, my beef with Vietnam has nothing to do with colonialism.
It was about the poor attitude I saw while there. It if difficult to be treated fair for foreigners in Vietnam, especially white people. However, It may happen the same for Vietnamese. Some Vietnamese people don't have a good awareness about the way they treat tourist. Obviously, the lost their long-term customer. I agree that while the risks, like those mentioned in this article, are greater, I think the rewards are as well.
Yes, I was ripped off, too. Literally, a xe om driver took the money from my hands. I met some hostile children. I was laughed at by strangers and I laughed with them. But a stranger on a bus also bought tea for me and a woman on a train gave me food. I met a guy at a cafe. After we talked for two hours, he paid for my coffee and gave me a ride across town for nothing, even after I offered.
And I could go on about all the Vietnamese I met and who I will remember for nothing more than their curiosity and kindness. I think it helped that the sentiments were often mutual. I have visited many countries in Asia and I have to say that Vietnam was my favorite! I found the locals to be extremely friendly and helpful.
I will say that I too was ripped off by street vendors and such, but I guess that is something that I was used to as I had previously lived in Thailand for almost three years. I out of all the countries I visited in SEA! Cambodia stood out the most! I can spend a whole month there and not get bored!
But I ventured mostly off the beaten path. I think most idyllic places that get overrun by tourism tend to be more of a pain to travel to, and require more vigilance, especially in the tourist areas. I also believe that you reap what you sow. For years I have been dismayed to see travelers go through countries in SE Asia and totally disrespect the culture. Anyone who has been there knows what I mean. We have, for better or worse, changed these cultures by our very presence. I only wonder how much longer that is going to last. As a former backpacker and now running a tour operator I have also noticed the odd difference in experinces between the budget and more upmarket travellers.
As Matt says those travelling in a more organised manner definitely seem to have a better time. However bear mind that backpackers are regarded wth much suspicion throughout the region. Perhaps Vietnamese are just more overtly rude to those they consider cheap. Bad move as in the long run many of our clients are grown up backpackers looking to return inn more stlye. I spent three weeks in Vietnam in and enjoyed myself, though on every bus I took I had to fight to pay something akin to what the locals were paying. I was warned about this before going, and so watched what others were paying, and then handed over the same.
I actually traveled to Vietnam for the first time last June and spent a month there. I experienced many of the negatives you mentioned, whether I was thought to be a local or acknowledged to be a foreigner usually happened as soon as opened my mouth and uttered my broken Vietnamese. The mentality of many of the locals seem to be that the world is a dog-eat-dog kind of world. Locals from different regions of Vietnam are known for different temperaments. The northerners are described as mean, hardworking, and smart.
The southerners are described as more laid-back, lazy, and go with the flow. Although I had my share of run-ins with rude, pushy, scamming, etc.
Glad I chanced upon your site! This is my exact same sentiment as well. I had a few nasty experiences in Vietnam and it so tainted my view of the country that I vowed never to go back there again. How to become a Social Justice Warrior. Think Like A Coward: The Secret Wisdom of Suspicion. We Never Would Have Guessed!: Become a Modern Artist: The Greatest and Easiest Job on Earth. The Magic Apple and his Mighty Friends. The Fanatical Fanboys of the 22 Yards. Never Trust Any God: Seven Habits to Tackle Tomorrow.
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